The co-founder of Century Radio, Mr Oliver Barry, referred to Mr Ray Burke as "the minister who is going to give us our licence" in a conversation in the Horseshoe Bar in the Shelbourne Hotel in Dublin, the tribunal has been told.
Prof Ray Hills, former general manager of the Independent Broadcasting Authority's Consultancy Services engineering division who was employed by Century, said this was Mr Barry's response when he asked who Mr Burke was, but it could have been "a throwaway remark".
Prof Hills had come to the bar after a meeting nearby with the other co-founder of Century, Mr James Stafford, some time before Century was awarded the nation al commercial radio licence in January 1989. He was providing consultancy advice to Century on transmission matters.
"We came across to the Shelbourne for a cocktail, and became involved with a group of individuals I didn't know. One of the individuals said the next round was his and I asked Oliver Barry who he was," he recalled.
"Mr Barry said: `That's Mr Burke, the minister who is going to give us our licence,' or words to that effect."
Mr Des O'Neill SC, for the tribunal, pointed out that it was the Independent Radio and Television Commission and not the minister for communications, Mr Burke, which decided on the allocation of broadcasting licences.
Prof Hills agreed, but added that it was his impression that somewhere in the legal framework the "ultimate decision" had to be referred by the commission to the minister for his approval. "It was certainly the first time a government minister has ever bought me a drink."
Afterwards, he did not dwell heavily on the implications of the remark, he added. This was the only time he had met Mr Burke.
Prof Hills said he had urged Century's principals to explore every possible avenue for reducing costs through hard-nosed negotiations with RTE, including ministerial pressure, if necessary.
He knew Mr Barry was an "important impresario" and that Mr Stafford had "a range of varied business interests". As to political influence, any reference to that must have come about "throughout comments made in discussions", he told Mr O'Neill.
"I was aware one or other knew politicians. I can't be more specific than that."
Mr O'Neill asked whether he had understood that the commission responsible for granting the commercial radio licence was to be an independent body devoid of political influence.
He replied that he expected it would be independent, along the lines of the IBA in Britain.
He first made contact with Century's co-founders at a meeting in Winchester in July 1988. It was not until November 24th, however, that he received a copy of the Radio and Television Act, 1988, from Mr Stafford.
Significantly, Section 16 of the Act stipulated:
"The Minister may, at the request of the Commission and after consultation with Radio Telefis Eireann, require the latter to co-operate with sound broadcasting contractors in the use of any mast, tower, site or other installation or facility needed in connection with the provision of transmission facilities for sound broadcasting services to be established under this Act."
Prof Hills advanced three possible approaches for his clients.
The first was a new network on a greenfield site, the second was to share aspects of the site infrastructure with RTE, the existing telecommunications operator and "self-provide" specific areas or transmission, and the third was to seek an agreement with RTE to provide all aspects of the new network on a contract basis.