GP not told gun given back to Carthy

THE BARR TRIBUNAL: John Carthy's psychiatrist has told the Barr tribunal he should have told Mr Carthy's GP that he had recommended the return of his patient's gun.

The gun had been confiscated by gardaí at Granard in August, 1998. Consultant psychiatrist Dr David Shanley wrote to the superintendent at Granard Garda station on October 13th, telling him Mr Carthy was fit to use a firearm. He said Mr Carthy's GP would let the Garda station know if there was a change in the situation.

However, the GP in question, Dr Patrick Cullen was never told about this. Yesterday, Dr Shanley said this should have happened. "I agree, Dr Cullen should have received a copy of that letter," he said, in response to a query from Mr Michael McGrath SC, for the tribunal.

Mr Carthy's family and his GP would be more likely to be aware of a change in his state of mind, Dr Shanley said. The gun was returned to Mr Carthy in November 1998.

Mr Diarmuid McGuinness SC, for the Garda Commissioner, asked why the letter had not been sent to Dr Cullen. "I would have expected that a copy of that letter should have gone to Dr Cullen. It didn't go," Dr Shanley said.

Mr Carthy had told him that gardaí had taken his gun as part of a routine check of all guns in the country "and I accepted that at face value. I had no reason to disbelieve that."

However, gardaí said they had taken the gun because they had received allegations that Mr Carthy had threatened people and had been unstable.

If Dr Shanley had known about the alleged threats, would he still have recommended the return of the gun? Mr McGrath asked. Dr Shanley said he would have asked to see Mr Carthy to discuss these allegations.

He said he Mr Carthy had not told him about his alleged assault by gardaí in Granard. Asked if the knowledge of both these incidents would have changed his mind about writing the letter, he said: "It is possible," but he would have had to meet Mr Carthy first.

"If I had been told that by the guards or his GP, I would have asked to have seen him again and gone through the allegations," he said. The threats might have been bravado and might not have amounted to anything.

Dr Shanley said he saw no difficulty in having Mr Carthy's gun reinstated as Mr Carthy had never been suicidal or homicidal. While Mr Carthy had referred to having suicidal thoughts, he had never mentioned a gun in this context.

Asked if he should have contacted gardaí when Mr Carthy had an episode of mania, Dr Shanley said he had never envisaged going to the gardaí every time his patient had an episode of elation or depression. It would be "most unfortunate" if gardaí removed Mr Carthy's gun every time he was unwell. "It would upset John. It would upset everybody."

The tribunal also heard that Mr Carthy had an appointment to see Dr Shanley on the day he was killed. Dr Shanley said Mr Carthy's sister Marie rang him some time in April, saying that he was unwell and needed to be seen. "There was a sense of urgency that I should see him," he said and he made an appointment for 2 p.m. on Holy Thursday.

Mr Carthy was shot dead by members of the Garda's Emergency Response Unit at about 5. 45 p.m. that day. He had been involved in a day-long stand-off with gardaí after he fired shots from the family home at Abbeylara in Longford.

The cross-examination of Dr Shanley continues this morning.