MR Proinsias De Ross a yesterday agreed in the High Court that in a newspaper interview in 1992 he had said that some people associated with the Workers' Party, who chose to be involved in other kinds of activity, had damaged the party beyond retrieve.
Mr Patrick MacEntee SC, for Independent Newspapers, referred to an article by Mr Eamonn Carr in the Evening Herald in March 1992.
Counsel quoted part of the interview. Mr Carr: "Can you expect the electorate to subscribe to the new party given that its members for years denied any involvement with the Official IRA and then discovered that there was that connection and that they had either been hoodwinked or were telling fibs?"
Mr De Rossa had replied: "People will have to make up their own minds on the basis of what they know of the individuals concerned.
"The fact that some people associated with the Workers' Party chose to be involved in other kinds of activity damaged the Workers' Party beyond retrieve. That's a fact of life. It would be a grave disservice to the vast majority of members, even those remaining with the party, to label them as Official IRA or whatever. They're not.
"If those of us who should haven known better can be accused of anything, it's that we were too trusting."
Mr De Rossa said the interview was done in almost 10 years after a Garda investigation into alleged counterfeiting of money at the back of the Workers' Party headquarters in Gardiner Place.
Mr MacEntee asked who were the "some people" who damaged the party beyond retrieve. Mr De Rossa said he had already told the court about an inquiry he conducted in 1991 after three people in Belfast were convicted of stealing a truckload of alcohol.
Counsel asked if he was saying that these young men had damaged the party beyond retrieve. Mr De Rossa said he was not There were allegations of various things such as the counterfeiting matter. Allegations of that kind clearly damaged the party.
Mr MacEntee asked him who were these people who chose to be involved in other activities. Mr De Rossa said that he had expelled a member of the Workers' Party who had been involved in the theft of the truckload of alcohol and also another person associated with the party.
Mr MacEntee asked if it was his sworn testimony that his reply to Mr Carr referred to the young men who had stolen a load of alcohol.
Mr De Rossa: "Specifically in relation to the facts known to me, yes.
Mr MacEntee asked what he had meant by "other kinds of activity" in the article. Mr De Rossa said that the case involving the truckload of alcohol was uppermost in his mind.
Counsel asked if he was saying that this was the only thing that he had inquired into in his entire association with the Workers' Party. Mr De Rossa replied that this had been specifically brought to his attention.
Mr MacEntee asked what he knew about this one unique inquiry. Mr De Rossa said a press report on a Belfast court brought to his attention that three people were charged with stealing the truck and it was alleged in the report that they were members of the Workers' Party.
He undertook to check the party files to see if that was true. One was listed as a member, one as an associate on the list for mailing and one was not listed at all. He reported it to the ardchomhairle proposing that they be expelled and this was agreed and done.
Mr MacEntee asked if he had made any inquiries as to whether they were armed. Mr De Rossa said that was a matter for the court. His concern was whether they were associated with the Workers' Party.
Pressed on whether he had tried to find out if they were armed, Mr De Rossa said it was an armed robbery. Mr MacEntee said that was the first time he had told them that. Counsel asked if he made any inquiry as to where the arms came from. Mr De Rossa said that was a matter for the courts. It was a matter for the RUC.
Mr MacEntee asked if he was saying that when he found out that members of his party were involved in an armed robbery, that he did not consider it any of his business to see how they came by a gun.
Mr De Rossa said the Workers' Party member was involved in handling the drink, not in carrying out the robbery itself. It was a matter for the gardai, and in this case, the RUC. "It just beggars belief that you would expect me to do the work of the RUC."
Mr MacEntee asked what other kinds of activities he was referring to in the Eamonn Carr interview. Mr De Rossa said he had no other activities in mind at that point. He was speaking in general terms and just as the question and reply indicated, he was refuting any association between the Official IRA and the Workers' Party.
Earlier, he said that in general he would have been referring to rumours and allegations made over a period of time. He discounted these rumours and allegations as political attacks, particularly in the context of Northern Ireland. When the specific case was brought to his attention he took action in relation to it.
Mr De Rossa said that the activity in general that he was referring to in the Evening Herald article included the political activities internal to the Workers' Party, which he was attempting to modernise. There were people in the party who were opposing the decisions made by the ardchomhairle and there was opposition to the sale of property by the party.
People were talking to other members of the party and urging them to organise against him and so forth. "That kind of activity led to the perception that the party was not democratic with everything I had done since becoming leader - that was to open up and ensure that it was democratic," added Mr De Rossa.
In January, he had proposed that the party be reconstituted. Two of the many people involved in the opposition and organising of the opposing faction were Mr Sean Garland, then treasurer, and Mr John Lowry, from Belfast.