On The Record

  • The Frontline and - oh vey! - Tommy Tiernan

    September 22, 2009 @ 1:53 pm | by Jim Carroll

    RTE’s new current affairs session The Frontline enjoyed a good start to its run last night. Sure, there were a couple of opening night niggles - they need to make the type on the info-ticker a lot bolder, Pat Kenny seemed a little hurried and harrassed as if he was trying to cram a two hour show into an hour and, wow, so that’s what Eamon Dunphy looks like without the services of the RTE make-up department - but these are ones which can be sorted out with time. Well, maybe not the latter.

    More importantly, the format, and how it served last night’s Nama subject matter, hit the nail on the head. Remember that The Frontline is replacing Questons & Answers so the most important thing for the new show is to get away from bland, set-piece questions from the audience and even blander set-piece answers from the panel. Instead of that hoary formula (which did serve Q&A well for a few years before it became the show’s downfall), we had Kenny wandering around the audience with his microphone and getting views and tales from what was going on in, as Fintan O’Toole later termed it, “the real economy”. It helped too that there didn’t seem to be as many party goons in the audience, though you had to admire the dude who used the opportunity to hawk a few houses in the midlands. Oh, and can someone please find an alternative use for Tom Parlon?

    Interestingly, the weakest link in the show was Kenny’s interview with Brian Lenihan. The Minister for Finance wiggled like a worm on the end of a fishing line and managed to escape relatively unscathed from the encounter. Sure, he wouldn’t have been so lucky in an one-on-one with, say Vinny Browne, but it’s also doubtful if Kenny would have been so lax on his radio show or if Browne would have been as thorough if he’d to keep a live studio audience engaged. Again, chalk it down to the opening night test-run. By the time The Frontline is a dozen shows into its run, government ministers might think twice about coming on the show.

    We’re unlikely, though, to see the unfunniest man in Ireland on the show and thank goodness for that. Yet again, he finds himself in the soup and, once again, he is probably laughing away to beat the band at the crack he has created.

    We speak, of course, of Tommy Tiernan, a comedian who has enjoyed huge success in Ireland by taking on the persona of that mad, loud, drunken gobshite in a woolly jumper that you cross the street to avoid. Thousands of Irish people, though, obviously don’t feel the same way and they have spent good money to sit through a few hours of Tiernan ranting, roaring and cursing at them. You keep hoping that he’s going to get some success elsewhere so he can go away and annoy other people, but then you realise that Tiernan is never going to do that. He’s as parochial as the parish pump.

    Yet again, Tiernan is in what he sees as his natural home (ie the limelight) after cracking a few Holocaust gags during a public interview at the recent Electric Picnic. Note, this wasn’t part of his actual show in the comedy teepee, this was a public interview so Tiernan’s high-faluting cant about specially-protected comedy environments does not apply. Naturally, because it’s Ireland and it’s Tiernan, the audience laughed their socks off. Tiernan, he’s such a hoot. He’s a mad bastard, a mad fecking bastard. Yahoo!

    Since the Trib ran the story on Sunday (and fair play to Ken Sweeney for digging it up), there has been a lot of fuming. This happens a lot with Tiernan so you could say that it has become his shtick: take a dig at some controversial subject and then sit back to wait for the reaction. We’ve been here before with Tiernan with his Madeline McCann and crucifixion gags, to name just two which kept Liveline in clover for days.

    But eventually folks will tire of the eejit who shouted “feck!” and will move along. Yes, there is such a thing as edgy comedy and some comedians are absolutely fantastic at juggling controversial subjects to the consternation and discomfort of their audience. But not Tiernan. When he takes on an edgy subject, all you get are the rants and raves of a very unfunny and increasingly deluded individual. It’s about time we sighed and moved on. Bet Pat Kenny is glad he doesn’t have to invite Tiernan onto his TV show ever again.

  • 93 Comments »

    1.
    September 22, 2009
    2:00 pm

    Spot on chief - I’ve never understood why people think Tiernan is so brilliant. He is, as you say, just that mad, ranty idiot you really want to avoid.

    Comment by Sandra
    2.
    September 22, 2009
    2:15 pm

    Bar the bizarre colour of Dunphy, I thought The Frontline was a fine edition to the RTE current affairs roster - if only they would now schedule The Week In Politics at a reasonable hour.

    Pat obviously still has the chops and once the teething problems are gotten over with, he’ll fully grow into the role. I’m not sure about the “satire” but all in all, a good effort and a nice set. A total contrast to The Apprentice on TV3, which looked like its meagre production budget had been slashed. The boardroom looks like it could have been in Crossroads and shudders every time they open that fake sliding door. That said, the door probably has more business acumen then almost all of this year’s apprentices – clueless.

    Comment by Ivor
    3.
    September 22, 2009
    2:27 pm

    Thought Frontline was brilliant. Makes a nice change from the shouty, dour Q&A that only rarely provided good TV.

    Dunphy and O’Toole were on top form and made the best points of the night.

    This is where Kenny belongs. His best decision ever was to leave the Late Late to someone who can do the lighter stuff.

    Comment by unarocks
    4.
    September 22, 2009
    2:28 pm

    Hey hey hey, Tiernan may be an unfunny prick but I can’t let this go by:

    the unfunniest man in Ireland

    Dave McSavage still walks the streets, and has even been given his own TV show.

    Comment by Ian
    5.
    September 22, 2009
    2:28 pm

    Clearly the unfunniest man in Ireland is the person writing those comedy sketches for The Frontline.

    Comment by Richard Dreyfus Affair
    6.
    September 22, 2009
    2:32 pm

    Enjoyed Frontline alright but was very disappointed that PK let Lenihan off without answering Fintan O’Toole’s question as to whether Fianna Fail were incompetent or complacant in allowing the current climate to develop.

    As for Tommy, he jumped the shark years ago. He once had a great way of telling a gag, a sort of descriptive stream of conscious that I really enjoyed. But over the last 5 years he’s moved more towards how you described - the raving loon who is just annoying, not funny.

    Why though, if all this happened at EP, is it only coming to light now?

    Comment by Joe
    7.
    September 22, 2009
    2:34 pm

    i think the whole tommy tiernan thing is revealing something about us all and our attitudes to anti-semitism. I’ve mentioned it to a few people and the response I’ve gotten a couple of times has either been a defense of Tiernan or along the lines of ‘ah sure he only made an ‘oul jewish joke’. Hmmm.

    If he had come out with that dinger in the States his career would have died on the spot, or in England he’d be open for prosecution under their hate laws. I mean, those comments were so far beyond the pale, that I am surprised the response in ireland has been so muted.

    I’m going to put it out there and say, also, that this Jewish stuff runs a bit deeper with Tiernan. I’ve seen him try to tackle the Israeli Palestine thing before (in a horrendously reductive and clumsy way), and near the end of the gag when he was getting all het up, he’d start switching from the word ‘israeli’ to ‘jews’, or I should say ‘jewwwwwssss’ with the mad stare in his eye.

    Like many I’m sure, I used to like Tommy Tiernan years ago. But ever since he started remodeling himself as some sort of mad mystic I’ve gone off him. He thinks he is imparting some sort of mad shamanic nuggets of wisdom through his shtick. Well, I say shame on the fucker. And shame on the shower of sheep that laughed at the most shocking ‘joke’ I’ve ever heard.

    Comment by Darragh
    8.
    September 22, 2009
    2:37 pm

    “But eventually folks will tire of the eejit who shouted “feck!” and will move along. ”

    If this was going to happen I reckon it would have done so already. Anyone who can fill Vicar street for 40+ nights must have more to his schtik than taking the mick out of controversial subjects, surely?

    Anyway, just clicked on your link to his website and he has posted a statement

    A Statement from Tommy Tiernan concerning accusations of anti-Semitism

    Firstly, I would like to say that as a private individual I am greatly upset by the thought that these comments have caused hurt to others as this was never my intention; yet, the Electric Picnic public interview with Hot Press Magazine has been taken so far out of context that I am quite bewildered.

    The things that I said in front of a live audience were in an attempt to explain my belief that one of the duties of the comic performer is to be reckless and irresponsible and that the things that they say should NEVER be taken out of context. If you read the full transcript or listen to the podcast you will see that I preface my rant by saying that it should not be taken seriously and as such, the rant took place as an example of my argument. While it is out of context, which it most definitely is now, it seems callous cruel and ignorant.

    This is not the first time that something like this has happened and it probably won’t be the last. However, as a public performer I can only hope that whatever wild, irresponsible and reckless things that come into my head will be taken in the context in which they were said.

    According to Hot Press editor, Niall Stokes: “if you see or read it in context, there is a comment in there about people who are fanatical and who can’t take a joke. But to interpret it as anti-Semitism is wrongheaded in the extreme. The way I see it, he is satirising anti-Semitism, while making a more general point that we should all be able to laugh at ourselves.”
    I

    Comment by JC
    9.
    September 22, 2009
    2:43 pm

    JC - was just about to publish that link as well.

    I don’t think his “statement” really gets away from the nub of the issue - Tiernan has been doing this sort of controversy hullabaloo over and over again to the extent that now, you can get odds on who he will offend next. My money is on sheep farmers or handball players.

    Comment by Jim Carroll
    10.
    September 22, 2009
    2:48 pm

    Clicking through his website I note that he is currently on tour in the west of Ireland, what is it they say, no such thing as a bad publicity?

    Comment by JC
    11.
    September 22, 2009
    2:49 pm

    “This is where Kenny belongs. His best decision ever was to leave the Late Late to someone who can do the lighter stuff.”

    (sorry,can’t do italics!)

    una, you raise an interesting point. namely that there is no reason that back in the day (say, for example, Uncle Gaybo’s heyday) that last nights Frontline could not have been a Late Late show.

    For the last number of years however, I think the country would have collectively keeled over if Kenny had attempted doing something along those lines. So, in a long winded manner, the point is this. What the hell happened to the Late Late as the station’s flagship CURRENT AFFAIRS (apologies for the caps!) show? Who decided that they would not tackle these issues in a serious manner, instead of having Coronation St actors/actresses? Who didn’t take Pat aside when he wanted to serious issues and tell him that he has an average audience of approx 1 million people, and to work away on that show?

    As per the Week in Politics, the Frontline is RTE refusing to treat its audience in a grown up manner, and instead shunting them to the side. (C’mon, 10.30pm is hardly box office…)

    Phew, rant over…

    Comment by ciaran
    12.
    September 22, 2009
    2:49 pm

    Just caught the last ten minutes of Frontline after getting in from the Cribs gig. It seems promising from the small bit I saw. Kenny is back where he belongs. Kenny got a lot of flack for his presenting style on the Late, Late Show but the truth is he should never have taken it on in the first place as interviewing vacuous UK celebs on their book promotional tour is clearly beneath him. He’s frighteningly intelligent and probably the best thing RTE have got so it’s good to see him back in current affairs. Leave the outmoded Late, Late show to intellectual lightweights like Ryan Tubridy. Frontline is a good replacement for Questions and Answers, a show that had its moments but in truth was a tired format and invariably descended into party political oneupmanship and petty squabbling - at least with Frontline issues can be discussed in a proper manner.

    Spot on about Tommy Tiernan too - his popularity in this country is completely mystifying but then again we Irish are an odd bunch - we mistake his (look at me, I’m mad, I’ll say anything!!) ranting and raving as comedy. It’s telling that his success has not expanded beyond these shores, not even in the UK where they seem to love Irish comedians. He is indeed as parochial as the parish pump. Unfuuniest man in Ireland? Joint unfunniest with Jason Byrne, another ‘comedian’ whose popularity is baffling - whereby Tiernan trades in tasteless wisecracks, Byrne simply pulls funny faces and apparently that’s comedy. ‘The Byrne Ultimatum’ actually made me depressed after watching last week. Awful. Who the hell gives the green light to this sort of garbage?? I truly despair.

    Comment by Quint
    13.
    September 22, 2009
    2:52 pm

    JC - wonder will he try out those lines on his next club-date in Jerusalem or Tel Aviv? We’ll see how his specially-protected comedy environment will work then.

    Comment by Jim Carroll
    14.
    September 22, 2009
    2:52 pm

    At first I was worried about the set-up last night - Pat Kenny adopting Kilroy’s walk and talk style combined with his legendary lack of empathy should have been a recipe for disaster. It was a tentative success in the end though, allowing for the disappointment of Brian Lenihan coming across quite well and Fintan O’Toole not getting answers to what were the most pertinent questions. Poor Fintan remains the best voice in the wilderness we have Jim - would you really rub it in and dispatch Tommy Tiernan there to join him? Harsh.

    The real success of the show though was the absolute incompetence of the two bankers on the panel for the first half of the show. Clueless, oblivious, and really quite frightening.

    Comment by brian
    15.
    September 22, 2009
    2:59 pm

    @ciaran: even in Gaybo’s day on the Late Late Show there were still ‘celebrity’ guests and musical acts. I don’t think you could have The Frontline on Friday nights. People are settling into the weekend and don’t want to be confronted with two hours of seriousness. It’s totally different on a Monday when the audience wants to be set up with a topic for discussion or contemplation for the week.

    The Late Late is what it is. Current affairs and entertainment, and now and again tackling that ’serious’ issue or topic that Tubridy Tonight could never touch.

    My only complaints about Frontline are that it should be on earlier, and that they should remove the glossy shine from behind where Kenny sits because you can see the camera operator in the reflection.

    Apart from those minor issues, Kenny and the production team should be very happy with an extremely promising start that failed to even remotely bore at any stage.

    Comment by unarocks
    16.
    September 22, 2009
    3:07 pm

    @Quint: I wouldn’t call Tubridy an intellectual lightweight. He’s an incredibly smart dude.

    Another moment I enjoyed on Frontline was when Dunphy told that dude who was selling €250,000 gaffs in Blanch to basically go fuck himself.

    Was disappointed that Lenihan didn’t answer O’Toole’s incompetent / complicit question. O’Toole’s best point was if we let NAMA happen it’s our fault for not saying stop. Great double act between Dunphy and O’Toole overall.

    Comment by unarocks
    17.
    September 22, 2009
    3:20 pm

    RTE won’t put The Frontline on any earlier. They need broader programmes on right after the Nine O’Clock News which rate better. BBC2 show Newsnight late, TV3 show Tonight With Vincent Browne late. There is a good audience for them at that time, despite the fact that it doesn’t quite suit everyone.

    Comment by Noise Annoys
    18.
    September 22, 2009
    3:20 pm

    Important point about Tommy Tiernan, taken from a comment on that Tribune article (nice that they allow comments on news stories, incidentally):

    “maybe Tommy doesn’t know it yet but we are all as guilty as the jews for the death of Christ Jesus and unless he repents and believes the gospel he will be in a much hotter fire than the ones burning in the ovens as Auschwitz. When that day comes there will be a smile on the other side of his face and he won’t be laughing then.”

    I think that really says it all. (Personally, I think Tiernan is deeply unfunny, but I don’t think it was always so, and I don’t think he’s a bigot.)

    Comment by Rosemary
    19.
    September 22, 2009
    3:25 pm

    @una - i’m not saying that they didn’t have entertainers back in the day, but that they were able to mix it up better, and attempt something akin to last nights show. Under Kenny’s helm I personally don’t believe they would have had the nous to do so.

    Comment by ciaran
    20.
    September 22, 2009
    3:40 pm

    on Tommy Tiernan

    I’m a fan.

    I sometimes think he turns it up to 11 when 10 would do but overall Tiernan is more than a “mad, ranty idiot”. much more.

    if i remember this rightly
    a few years ago he did a great night on today fm with tom dunne. where instead of desert island discs they did a selection of comedy from tommy’s collection of the greats.
    his commentary & understanding of the art of comedy, especially where it fits historically and in society was very very impressive.

    seems to be a big fan of lenny bruce.

    I was in the chat room, (by accident !) on the day.
    what he was doing was not a sketch or a routine but a decent discussion of the limits of comedy and what it is about.

    he was ridiculing extremists using satire.

    Comment by neil c
    21.
    September 22, 2009
    4:06 pm

    Unfunniest man in Ireland?

    It is easily Dave Mc Savage- The man is quite simply a tool. Whenever i see him doing his busking “comedy” routine on the streets of Dublin i really do cringe with embarrassment for him. Although, Ed Byrne and Jason Byrne are deplorable too.

    Funniest man in Ireland?

    In my opinion it is David O’Doherty.

    I used to like Tiernan but i have gone off him and would agree with most of the comments above.

    I used to really like “questions and answers” and was sad to see it end but frontline looks like it might be a decent replacement and Kenny looked far more comfortable on it than he ever did on the late late.

    Comment by Tom
    22.
    September 22, 2009
    4:09 pm

    If tiernan is the unfunniest man in ireland, who do you think is the funniest ?

    Comment by stephen
    23.
    September 22, 2009
    4:27 pm

    Jim - ‘fair play to Ken Sweeney for digging it up’ and ‘it’s about time we sighed and moved on’: two contadictory statements, surely?

    i don’t care for Tommy Tiernan much, but this whole witch-hunt from the mainstream media is a bit off really. everyone knows the deal with Tiernan by now, but i’m sure there’s loads of stand-ups who come out with far worse stuff. and taking comments like that out of context is a cardinal sin of the media.

    as for the comment @13, isn’t that the whole point of living in a society where freedom of speech is upheld?

    if he’s fishing for controversy, does that not make Ken Sweeney just as bad for taking the bait?

    Comment by daniel harrison
    24.
    September 22, 2009
    4:42 pm

    At last someone admitting they dont like Tommy Tiernan. Just because you shout doesnt make you funny. Strange that if it werent for the catholic church he wouldnt have a routine bearing in mind how much he goes on about it. Those programmes about him trying to break america showed him to be a pretentious artist. To quote Shaun Ryder ” it took me years of psychoanalysis to realise I wasnt just a drunken yob I am an artist. Now can some one please have a go at Des Bishop. Yes we know the irish are strange and have funny ways but we didnt need you to tell us so fuck off back to america. Rant over.

    Comment by Feathers McGraw
    25.
    September 22, 2009
    5:10 pm

    It seems to be a common thread of stand up comics to get louder and more racist/sexist/bigotted when they run out of ideas. Check out the Youtube clip of Michael “Kramer” Richards when he lost the plot at a stand up gig in LA.

    We put up with some amount of right wing bullshit in the name of free speech or the ease with which you can castigate someone by saying “allegedly”. None of us want to curtail free speech but Tommy Tiernan deserves all he gets for those comments. He should not stand behind a “I’m only joking and I told you so” or ” I know loads of travellers/jews etc. and they find me funny” defence and give a full unqualified apology. We have a small jewish community in Ireland and maybe we are not as sensitive to his comments.

    Comment by overfriendlyconcierge
    26.
    September 22, 2009
    5:14 pm

    Anyone got a link to the complete transcript of his sketch as of course out of context it sounds awful but has anyone ever listened to Lenny Bruce?

    A comic genius that got in a “tad” bit of trouble himself when people reacted directly to single words he spoke rather than the entire act in its whole

    Comment by G-Man
    27.
    September 22, 2009
    5:44 pm

    Jim - ‘fair play to Ken Sweeney for digging it up’ and ‘it’s about time we sighed and moved on’: two contadictory statements, surely?

    Daniel @ 23 - Nope, not at all. One is tipping the hat to a fellow hack for this story and the other is more to do with this idea that Tiernan is funny

    Just because you shout doesnt make you funny.

    It seems to be a common thread of stand up comics to get louder and more racist/sexist/bigotted when they run out of ideas

    Bang on Feathers and OC. To try to excuse this as out of context or whatever is to miss the bigger picture.

    Comment by Jim Carroll
    28.
    September 22, 2009
    5:48 pm

    it shouldn’t have to be pointed out that there is an ocean of difference between Tiernan’s comments and ‘Kramer’ screaming racist abuse at one particular person in the audience

    Comment by daniel harrison
    29.
    September 22, 2009
    7:19 pm

    @ 26 GMan,

    At least Lenny Bruce was funny. Tommy Tiernan is not.

    Comment by Leigh O'Gorman
    30.
    September 22, 2009
    7:29 pm

    Tommy Tiernan’s comments are abhorrrent. They are about as offensive as it’s possible to get. It is absolutely irrelevant whether he’s just letting out his “inner lunacy”, to say these things is totally unacceptable.

    Having said this I am not at all surprised that the audience laughed and seemed to enjoyed it. Irish audiences are, in the main, like sheep.

    Racism, which is what this so obviously is, should be highlighted and stamped out. It is not forgiveable on the grounds that he himself is not a bigot, the comments in of themselves are totally unforgiveable. Any acceptance of this kind of behaviour is as repugnant as the comments themselves.

    Comment by Conor Furlong
    31.
    September 22, 2009
    7:42 pm

    “f he had come out with that dinger in the States his career would have died on the spot, or in England he’d be open for prosecution under their hate laws. I mean, those comments were so far beyond the pale, that I am surprised the response in ireland has been so muted.”

    Good, that makes Ireland one of the last free countries in the world. The “hate thought” legislation generally protects certain groups and not others, if hate crime legislation were to protect England’s historical victims against biogtry it would ban anti-Catholicism and that would be the end of the Guardian, the BBC and the Independent. One surely doesn’t want that.

    Jewish humour is often cruel at other’s expense ( and, no, I dont get the “irony” bull”). Like Ali G. Like Borat. Like Bruno. All steorotypes ( the first is pretty much blackface, except without the empathy of a minstrel show). Kajikistan is a vitim of history too, you know. Also there have been numerous British articles about Irish people eating potatoes and thus causing their own famine ( A. A. Gill). i dont think that should be prosecuted, but if anything should be - given historical guilt - then that should be. The rest is vitors history.

    Comment by Eugene
    32.
    September 22, 2009
    8:00 pm

    @ 30 - If i was there, i wouldn’t have been laughing - i think it was a pathetic attempt at humour for sure. but i’m not going to join the queue to flog TT:

    i watch South Park religiously, think it’s the best show on TV, and that show is full to the brim with tasteless, politically incorrect jokes. it’s also won a number of Grammys. i’d be an absolute hypocrite to attack Tiernan because i don’t think he’s as funny as South Park

    Comment by daniel harrison
    33.
    September 22, 2009
    9:42 pm

    I think comedy is a lot like music: it invokes strong reactions in people, but it also makes them very angry when it doesn’t connect with them. Hence somebody like Tommy Tiernan - people don’t just dislike his humour, they have to actually hate him as a person. And he enjoys it.

    Personally, I think he’s hilarious. His entire schtick is based on pushing people’s buttons (contrary to people’s assumptions, he does make fun of Muslims) and I don’t buy that he’s remotely upset by people’s reactions, but I’m still a big fan of his.

    I think at least some of the outrage being expressed is motivated more by aversion to his humour than moral outrage.

    Comment by Dave
    34.
    September 22, 2009
    9:53 pm

    “Jewish humour is often cruel at other’s expense”

    If that ain’t a generalised anti-semitic comment, then I don’t know what is?

    Tiernan made some remarks during his Hot press interview about the murdering of more than the 6 million Jews. He said that 10/11 million should have been killed.
    He maintains that he was trying to get some laughs…and surprise, surprise, the Irish audience present laughed. What is frightening about all this is his not seeing that this is the sort of “joke” that Nazis would make about the Holocaust, and is simply unfunny. But more frightening is the audience’s laughter. Says a lot about them. I dare him to go to Tel Aviv and try the same remarks on.

    Comment by mike
    35.
    September 22, 2009
    10:48 pm

    “Jewish humour is often cruel at other’s expense ( and, no, I dont get the “irony” bull”). Like Ali G. Like Borat. Like Bruno. All steorotypes ( the first is pretty much blackface, except without the empathy of a minstrel show).”

    Eugene - for a big point about Jewish humour, all your examples from errr, one person, Sacha Baron Cohen.

    Comment by Darragh
    36.
    September 22, 2009
    10:58 pm

    Una@16 - ‘@Quint: I wouldn’t call Tubridy an intellectual lightweight. He’s an incredibly smart dude.’

    Granted, he’s not stupid - far from it. But I watched him for the first time on the Late, Late on the RTE Player as I heard Richard Dawkins was on, whom I am huge fan of. Dawkins was on to promote his new book about the evidence for evolution but Tubridy instead concentrated on Dawkins’ atheist beliefs. He fired questions at the rather bemused looking professor, interrogating him rather than engaging in proper discussion, as he did with Brian Cowen. Tubridy seemed fearful of Dawkins’ intellect and was clearly out of his depth, which is why I would describe him as a bit of a lightweight when it comes to the ‘big’ stuff. He’s more suited to superficial fluff like interviewing the Nolan sisters, etc.

    Comment by Quint
    37.
    September 22, 2009
    11:39 pm

    @35 - yep, sacha baron cohen who is Jewish himself.

    Comment by daniel harrison
    38.
    September 23, 2009
    12:02 am

    i used to be a big TT fan. check out some of his early DVD’s particularly the first one recorded in Galway, you’ll find an intelligent , uniquely Irish comedian at the top of his game. Somewhere along the line , he lost his way and turned into a mouthy, shouting pain in the arse. what he did at EP was shite. and he cant get away with the ‘ im an artist performing give me me license’ crap - he wasnt performing , he just being a mouth gobshite shouting shite in a tent . he’s got what he wanted though , everyone talking about him , being ’shocked’ . Im not shocked, im just disappointed that comedian i loved aint funny anymore….

    Comment by tayor
    39.
    September 23, 2009
    12:41 am

    This thread is developing into something of a free speech vs incitement argument. Like it or not Ireland has a somewhat less liberal interpretation of the USA’s first amendment. In essence the right to free speech exists here but is qualified. While I agree that Tiernan’s comments were wholly insensitive and cack-handed, he is a comedian (that’s a COMEDIAN and not someone propagating these views on a monthly newsletter - as far as I’m aware) and, as he says himself, a private individual. What I’d like to know from someone reading this who might know better is where his comments leave him in relation to Ireland’s new Blasphemy Law?

    Anyway, walk out, don’t laugh or whatever. But let’s leave the moral outrage for a more dangerous target.

    Comment by barryb
    40.
    September 23, 2009
    9:08 am

    Jim - Hallelujah! Someone tells it like it is on Tiernan.

    Una - Go on, say it - CameraMAN.

    Eugene - Those poor Kajiks, history has indeed been cruel to those crazy ass Kazakh/Tajik hybrids.

    barryb - If you’re on a stage you are not a ‘private individual’.

    Comment by dealga
    41.
    September 23, 2009
    9:35 am

    Syl Fox came into my job last week, now there’s a comedian. It will be a sad day the day Syl gets to tell St. Peter one of his own jokes at the gate :)

    Comment by Giles
    42.
    September 23, 2009
    9:41 am

    @ 39

    BarryB

    “What I’d like to know from someone reading this who might know better is where his comments leave him in relation to Ireland’s new Blasphemy Law?”

    Aaahh sure, he’s only one of that lads, he doesn’t need to be worrying about silly things like that.
    Should it be someone that happened to be somewhat out of loop, I think the circus would have swooped in for the kill by now.

    Comment by Leigh O'Gorman
    43.
    September 23, 2009
    10:07 am

    tayor@38

    I was just about to reply but you said it better than I could. As you say, Tiernan has lost his way. He is probably the best observational comedian we’ve ever had in this country but he becomes less and less focused when his observations are from a high-horse.

    Those Cracked and Loose shows from about 5 years ago are the funniest comedy I’ve ever witnessed. He’s obviously got his haters though, who are now rubbing their hands with glee.

    He should go away for a few years and give people a break. I hope he does.

    Comment by Peter81
    44.
    September 23, 2009
    10:13 am

    Jaysus, get over yourself the lot of you.

    I heard Alan Shatter on the radio yesterday saying Tommy only came out with this stuff for publicity. Looks like Al’s doing ok out of it too.

    As in the past, these comments are taken out of the context the environment and mood in which they were said. You can’t fart around a Jewish person without getting them upset. I’m still a big fan of Tommy Tiernan and I hate anything anti-semetic. This isin’t that.

    Comment by Bert Stanfield
    45.
    September 23, 2009
    10:17 am

    Bert - I’m still a big fan of Tommy Tiernan and I hate anything anti-semetic. This isin’t that.

    Which is where I need to come back in again and point everyone back to the big picture as articulated by many, many posters above - Tommy Tiernan: not as good as he used to be.

    Yes, I agree that there is an element of that “so I hear Ted you’re a racist now” scene from Father Ted to all of this but the fact remains that Tiernan has become a boorish, boring, ranting, raving comic in recent years better known for his various controversaries than any comic talent he may once have possessed. This latest spat has merely amplified that.

    Comment by Jim Carroll
    46.
    September 23, 2009
    10:52 am

    seriously, you have to question the racous laughter those comments were greeted with.

    Say a few curse words on stage and we’re all in bits. In ireland the craic is top priority. I was at a tiernan gig about 4 years ago now and sat there motionless while everybody, i mean everybody, pissed themselves for the entire show.
    You had the couple in front of me who turned to each other after every joke just to confirm that it was indeed funny. I think we feel there’s something wrong with us if we’re not doubled over with uproarious laughter on a constant basis. My friend who i went with spent the rest of the night asking me what was wrong with me. I just didnt find him funny, AT ALL

    Comment by Michael
    47.
    September 23, 2009
    11:01 am

    Yeah, he’s not nearly as funny as he used to be at all and that’s a great loss to us - he was easily our best stand-up comedian back in the day.Shame.
    As an aside, do people really think David O’Doherty is funny?? I find that harder to believe than anything else here.

    Comment by adam
    48.
    September 23, 2009
    11:22 am

    David O’Doherty’s pretty good. Clever and witty without resorting to Tiernans loud antagonism but he’ll probably never get the boggers on his side like Tiernan does.

    Comment by Peter81
    49.
    September 23, 2009
    11:32 am

    Bert Stanfield:

    Your prejudiced comment that “You can’t fart around a Jewish person without getting them upset” is a blatent and despicable example of anti-semitism. I presume that you have based this observation on you - or your friends - having farted around a lot of Jewish people. Thus one wonders why you - and your mates - chose to do this. I would imagine if the word gets out that you fart around Jews, then they and most other reasonable people might have good reason to get upset, and avoid you, don’t you think? Or does your anti-semitism - as reflected by your comment - blind you to this possibility.

    In view of your farting proclivity around Jewish people, I would strongly advise you to avoid visiting New York, as continuous farting could prove fatal for you.

    Mike

    Comment by mike
    50.
    September 23, 2009
    11:35 am

    Seriously, 2009 and people are still getting offended by comedians? The reason why Ken Sweeney had to dig it up was because no-one cared in the first place I would imagine.

    TT’s first DVD is one of the finest comedy sets of recent years. Since then, he’s gone a bit stale and more shouty, less funny.

    There isn’t a comedian in the world that hasn’t offended some gorup or other, from Lenny Bruce, Bill Hicks, Dylan Moran, Sarah Silverman and Sascha Cohen…wait the last two are jewish, they can make holocaust jokes.

    People need to cop on if they’re getting offended by what a comedian says, public interview or otherwise, unless that reason for the offence is paying E20 for a crap set, then that’s fine.

    Seriously, I hard far more offensive jokes growing up. Who is Ken Sweeney to decide what jokes crossing the line? Need i miss his appoinment as the nation’s joke czar?

    Comment by nerraw
    51.
    September 23, 2009
    11:37 am

    Adam@47 - ”As an aside, do people really think David O’Doherty is funny?? I find that harder to believe than anything else here”

    Very overrated comedian, don’t get all that ‘quirky’ keyboard stuff he does. There are a lot of Irish ‘comedians’ I just don’t find funny at all…Tiernan, Neil Delamere, David Maxwell, Des Bishop and the excrutiatingly awful Jason Byrne. There’s nothing worse than seeing them all smugly sitting together on The Panel with the their pre-prepared quips and gags. Dara O’ Briain and Ardal O’Hanlon are the best we have, genuinely funny and clever but also likeable.

    Comment by Quint
    52.
    September 23, 2009
    11:41 am

    nerraw @ 50 - i hope that whinge isn’t related to the fact that a rival Sunday paper got the story ;-)

    Oh and for the record, Bren Berry is officially the funniest man in Ireland. I hope he will now print this out and use it on the back of his business card.

    Comment by Jim Carroll
    53.
    September 23, 2009
    11:48 am

    Peter@48′…but he’ll probably never get the boggers on his side like Tiernan does’

    WTF? What a strange comment. So that’s why he’s so popular - the boggers like him! Like a comedy version of The Stunning. As a ‘bogger’ myself, I can’t stand the guy - why would his humour appeal to me because I’m from the country? Is there some sort of rural/urban divide now when it comes to what people find funny? Humour is subjective -it’s not about what part of the country you’re from.

    Comment by Quint
    54.
    September 23, 2009
    11:50 am

    Oi Peter81, I hate that shit that only ‘boggers’ like Tommy Tiernan or whoever.
    Is David O’Doherty considered erudite, witty and urbane coz he has a wanky accent?
    I’d imagine his humour would sit well with these ‘boggers’ you speak of (I’m presuming you’re using the term in the pejorative sense?) since it revolves around a toy keyboard, inane songs and stories about penguins.
    D.O.I. I’m a bogger ;)

    Comment by adam
    55.
    September 23, 2009
    11:52 am

    Quint @ 53 to Peter @ 48 - perfect retort. No need to add anything. Well, bar if boggers are supposed to like Tiernan, does this mean that sophisticated metropolitan types like himself are all Aslan and Brendan O’Carroll fans?

    Comment by Jim Carroll
    56.
    September 23, 2009
    11:55 am

    haha. Not at all Jim. lol I’m currently in holidays in Japan, which explains terrible grammer, mostly, sipping a beer so free of the burden of work. I just don’t get comedian x offended me. And who’s to judge when a comedian crosses the line? A mass walk out, yes, but not a news reporter. Unless its McSavage

    Comment by nerraw
    57.
    September 23, 2009
    12:02 pm

    nerraw - you’re on hols AND reading the blog? Dude, we salute you with sake. Have a good one.

    Comment by Jim Carroll
    58.
    September 23, 2009
    12:07 pm

    “WTF? What a strange comment. So that’s why he’s so popular - the boggers like him!”

    Yes. He appeals to a huge chunk of the population where other comedians like DO’D rely on (or resort to) being a bit more exclusive in their humour. They’re not bogger-friendly.

    Comment by Peter81
    59.
    September 23, 2009
    12:11 pm

    Peter81 - so, let me get this right. you’re implying that boggers dont like DO’D?

    Hold on, hold on, I think I have rumbled this. You are DAVE McSAVAGE. You are, aren’t you?

    Comment by Jim Carroll
    60.
    September 23, 2009
    12:15 pm

    Aside from whether Tiernan is funny or not anymore, is the shear number of comments on this blog post not evidence enough that Tommy saying something offencive is a nice and handy way to engage readers? It happened at EP, chill out people, there hasn’t been an incredible surge in Naziism since EP has there? Nor had there been after x amount of South park episodes that come up with increasingly inventive ways of being Antisemetic, or Borat or the millions of other comedians/comedy programmes that resorted to using a Jew gag.

    Saw Dave MacSavage on t he street on Sunday doing his thing, it wasn’t really funny, as in it didn’t seem like a real professional at work, and even worse were the the ways in which he tried to gode people into buying his DVD. “All proceeds go to my two retarded daughters” being one example.

    Comment by Stone Throwing Youths
    61.
    September 23, 2009
    12:19 pm

    They’re onto me, I better cut to a song…

    Before I incite a riot of the b(l)oggers here today, let me just say I’m a Tipp man myself and I know the audience. If you gave Tommy Tiernan a mic in a GAA club in Clonmel for an hour he would go down well. I don’t think you could say the same for D’OD. However if you put O’Doherty in Whelans for an hour he might even do better than Tommy T. It’s that kind of humour.

    Comment by Peter81
    62.
    September 23, 2009
    12:31 pm

    Peter81 My Dad’s from Clonmel.You too? I used to go to hurling training at home in Galway when I was a youngster in full Tipp colours. Dicing with death. And you’re right about the Whelans thing. DOD would be ‘culturally relevant’ there. Prob be a ‘comedy bro’.

    Comment by adam
    63.
    September 23, 2009
    12:42 pm

    Peter81 - feel free to throw Killinaskully into the mix and shout ‘checkmate’

    http://www.rte.ie/arts/2008/1230/rte.html
    http://www.rte.ie/arts/2007/1231/rte.html

    Wild generalisations time: We Irish aren’t funny, we just think we are. The Brits absolutely cane us when it comes to stand-up, sit-coms and satire.

    We Irish also don’t have the wonderful sense of humour we think we do, we just laugh at the loudest, obnoxious coconut in the room… and heaven help the Jonny Foreigner who dares slag us off.

    But we’re funnier than the whole of continental Europe put together.

    Comment by dealga
    64.
    September 23, 2009
    1:06 pm

    Maybe Tommy Tiernan will be the first person to be charged under the new blasphemy legislation?

    Comment by unarocks
    65.
    September 23, 2009
    1:11 pm

    Surely the funniest person in Ireland at the moment is Mary Coughlan. Her comment about Einstein developing the theory of evolution at the launch of smart technology initiative was the funniest thing I’ve heard in a long time. The scariest person in the world is strangely enough Mary Coughlan. Technically shes in charge today. We’d better watch ourselves.

    Comment by Feathers McGraw
    66.
    September 23, 2009
    1:50 pm

    The church have weighed into the debate - way hey!! It really is like Father Ted now.
    http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/frontpage/2009/0923/1224255064144.html?via=mr

    I think we have to separate the ‘Tommy Tiernan is shite’ argument from the ‘Tommy Tiernan is an anti-semite’ argument, because they seem to be getting muddled.

    If you think Tommy Tiernan is shit, fair enough. If you think he’s good, fair enough. I haven’t seen enough of him over the years to have an opinion myself. He’s off my radar and he doesn’t bother me. As for the accusations of anti-semitism, until we see a full transcript of the WHOLE converstion/performance from the EP then I don’t think anyone can make a judgement. Why do you think the Tribune printed this a couple of weeks after the event? I read that article myself on the Sunday it was printed and my first reaction was - “slow news day, shit stirring”.

    Comment by Noise Annoys
    67.
    September 23, 2009
    1:51 pm

    Noise - I think we have to separate the ‘Tommy Tiernan is shite’ argument from the ‘Tommy Tiernan is an anti-semite’ argument, because they seem to be getting muddled.

    see comment 45 above.

    Comment by Jim Carroll
    68.
    September 23, 2009
    2:06 pm

    if boggers are supposed to like Tiernan, does this mean that sophisticated metropolitan types like himself are all Aslan and Brendan O’Carroll fans?

    How we got to talking about the unfunniest man in Ireland and went this long without mentioning that charlatan is beyond me.

    “How’s your gibbly wibbet?” + cross dressing + cackle = numerous ‘comedy’ DVDs

    Comment by Joe
    69.
    September 23, 2009
    2:11 pm

    Maybe Tommy Tiernan will be the first person to be charged under the new blasphemy legislation?

    Una, it would be a terrific challenge for a well dodgy law. I’d love to see TT in court defending his act on the basis of its “genuine literary, artistic, political, scientific, or academic value”. Even if he were to lose, I’m sure he could afford the fine.

    Comment by Ivor
    70.
    September 23, 2009
    2:45 pm

    @37 Eh, I know SBC is Jewish. My point stands though. I meant that it is a very weak point to make a generalization about something as huge and nebulous as ‘Jewish humour’ by drawing all three of your examples from one person. Hardly the stuff of sound arguments.

    Comment by Darragh
    71.
    September 23, 2009
    2:49 pm

    Jim, the Trib article was a typically low piece of tabloid journalism. An example of just taking something out of context and stirring shit. Tiernan was attempting to make a point. You on the other hand obviously don’t like the man and would prefer to play him rather than the ball. At least make an attempt to tackle the issue in an intelligent manner without letting your subjectivity cloud your judgement.

    Maybe you should just stick to baiting Radiohead fans.

    Oh, and Una, Tubridy is “smart”, but smart is one thing. Having intellectual credentials is another, “dude.” Anyway, with a bit of luck bigging him up like that might get you a panel gig on the Late Late.

    Comment by Dave
    72.
    September 23, 2009
    2:55 pm

    Dave - sorry dude, you’re missing the point. See comment 45 above. This is about the big picture - Tommy Tiernan, not as good as he used to be and how the current kerfuffle just reinforces that.

    Comment by Jim Carroll
    73.
    September 23, 2009
    3:02 pm

    If we can keep up on the outrage, Tommy might yet appear on next week’s Frontline…

    Comment by brian
    74.
    September 23, 2009
    3:06 pm

    Jim - sorry, I didn’t think the point being made by Diarmuid Martin and all the other knee jerk reactionists was that Tommy Tiernan isn’t as good as he used to be. And sure enough this whole thing does amplify how bad he’s gotten in the past few years, but really the “big picture” isn’t about that. It’s about whether an admittedly past his sell by date comic can say what he likes once he gives a context for it.

    And yeah, s’pose I am pretty handy with the aul flat barbs.

    Comment by Dave
    75.
    September 23, 2009
    3:14 pm

    Dave - we’re obviously dealing with 2 different big pictures. My one is outlined in comment 45 and your one is outlined at 74 and 71. And, while I think there is room for both, the one I started out with - ie Tommy Tiernan is rubbish - is the one I’ll stick with here.

    Comment by Jim Carroll
    76.
    September 23, 2009
    5:23 pm

    I comepletely agree with you Jim. Tiernan has been doing this kind of thing for years now. Frankly, I never found it funny, nor particularly offensive either. I just found it stupid. I suppose we can infer from Tiernan’s holocaust remarks that there’s a DVD release coming up soon…

    Comment by Patrick
    77.
    September 23, 2009
    6:22 pm

    I don’t know whether Tiernan is or is not anti-Semitic. But I strongly believe that his comments are the most offensive and hurtful that anyone could have made about the Holocaust. Recall that he told Hot press the the following:

    “But these Jews, these f***ing Jews come up to me. These f***ing Christ killing bastards. F***ing six million? I would have got 10 or 12 million out of that. No f***ing problem. Two at a time they would have gone. Hold hands, get in there, leave us your teeth and your glasses.”

    If he thinks this is comical, then the men in the white coats should be sent for immediately.

    The problem is that he - and those brainless idiots who laughed at his comments - has now shamed all of us in Ireland, and give us all the reputation abroad as being a people who mock and joke about the Holocaust.

    I look forward to seeing how he will be received on his upcoming tour of the USA in 3 weeks time. I predict that either it will be cancelled, or if it does take place that he will be subject to a lot of bad publicity, and well earned. So, if not an antisemite, then he’s either a bloody idiot or just plain bonkers.

    Comment by mike
    78.
    September 23, 2009
    10:26 pm

    “The problem is that he - and those brainless idiots who laughed at his comments - has now shamed all of us in Ireland, and give us all the reputation abroad as being a people who mock and joke about the Holocaust”

    Amen sister. Im literally drowning in my own ignominy. And maybe it would be better for the rest of the world if I just stop fighting, let my lungs fill with shame and take my rightful place in hell for daring to be even on the same land mass as this comedy Hitler. I just couldnt face the Belgians after this. Just knowing they know is causing my ass to weep the ancient brown remorse of Cooley all over my passport.

    Comment by Joan's River
    79.
    September 23, 2009
    10:42 pm

    He was good in that episode of Father Ted where he played a depressed priest. Apart from that he can fuck off.

    Comment by Neill
    80.
    September 24, 2009
    9:12 am

    Good column from David Adams today about Tiernan and his ranting ways touching on some of the things people have commented about above:

    http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/opinion/2009/0924/1224255125020.html

    Comment by Jim Carroll
    81.
    September 24, 2009
    10:36 am

    Regardless of whether Tiernan is any good or whether he’s a raving attention-seeking celebrity, I am still waiting to see someone publish a full transcript of the conversation/interview (or whatever it was) that took place at the Electric Picnic to make a proper judgement about the whole situation. Where is it?

    To me, this reminds me so much of those occurences in the past when people (usually the church and other self-appointed moral guardians) have denounced various films, publications etc without having established the most basic connection with the material concerned.

    Comment by Noise Annoys
    82.
    September 24, 2009
    10:58 am

    rabble rabble rabble!
    grrr!
    my opinion matters!

    rabble rabble!
    far more important things in the world that what Tommy Tiernan said over 2 weeks ago.

    worth mentioning that during today’s festivities for that stout that we should think of all the Johnny Walker workers who Diageo have decided to fire because they want to move the Walker factory out of Kilmarnock, all those million spent for today’s party could have kept Johnny Walker in Kilmarnock and kept 700 jobs.

    Comment by paddy m
    83.
    September 24, 2009
    11:18 am

    Right, so David Adams is angry about Tiernan, but again the article is inspired by subjective hatred rather than logical reasoning. We all know Tommy Tiernan was looking for publicity, we all know he’s deteriorated as a comedian (the wife and I sat stony faced through his DVD Cracked, and that was a long time ago - awful stuff). What we need is a commentator who can sit down and go through the whole thing with a degree of real analysis and objectivity.

    Adams piece is a thinly disguised rant, nothing more than that. Come on, people. Stop being juvenile, and get to grips with the subject.

    The piece is just another example of the dumbing down of Irish Times opinion. Wheel out Fintan. There’s a man who can give a good kicking without resorting to flimsy half baked personal opinion.

    Comment by Dave
    84.
    September 24, 2009
    11:24 am

    It was — the rant — prompted by an audience’s member’s question: “have you ever been accused of being anti-Semite?” Oh the irony… or not.

    It’s on his website: https://www.tommytiernan.com/podcasts/ — it’s right in the last couple of minutes.

    If you listen you can see the context in which he made the above comments. He kinda of gets muddled telling a story, starts to lose his thread and ends up doing the “ironic” and in my opinion not funny rant by way of saying “fuck this — yes yes I am an anti-Semite.”

    He was trying to be funny. He failed in lots of people’s opinions. He also offended thousands more when his comments were aired or printed,

    But Tiernan didn’t cause offense intentionally though… um… he did say something offensive deliberately — albeit with a mad rush of blood to the head (comedian’s are by nature over excitable and constantly sticking their feet in their mouths).

    So enough with the conspiracy “he must be releasing a DVD next week” theories. Or even the “he must be trying to prop up his career”-angle as suggested by David Adams. If you listen to the podcast you can see it’s not premeditated unless people are suggesting he planted the question maker in the crowd.

    Comment by Teddy
    85.
    September 24, 2009
    12:16 pm

    Kitty Holland wrote a brilliant, cutting write-up about Tiernan’s wedding in the Times a few months ago: http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2009/0810/1224252314427.html

    Ó hEochagáin wore a matching sense of importance -
    What a great line.

    Comment by P&M
    86.
    September 25, 2009
    1:24 pm

    @P&M
    That was neither cutting nor brilliant, just bitchy.

    Comment by Lutin
    87.
    September 25, 2009
    4:06 pm

    You know, I dont think its really fair for music lovers to comment on comedians. As a music lover, one of the great things about an album, song you love is that you can listen to it again and again, and often, if its good, it gets better with the listening.

    Comedy on the other hand, tends to devalue and always has to be fresh. A comedian cannot really get away with telling the same joke twice, so there is possibly more pressure on comedians to be creative and to keep seeking out new audiences, than for musicians, who can always fall back on performance if they are suffering from any kind of writers block.

    I dont think TV particularly likes Tommy Tiernan, his energy seems to work better live. Though it is a few years now since I saw him. Ok sometimes he is controversial for the sake of it, but then again so many others today are too. Remember there used to be one controversial bitchy journalist at every newspaper, who you guiltily laughed at, but now its hard to find someone humble enough not to go that way.

    Just another perspective.

    Comment by Finola
    88.
    September 25, 2009
    5:05 pm

    “You know, I dont think its really fair for music lovers to comment on comedians”

    Me too. I don’t think it’s really fair for music lovers to comment either on politicians or schol-teachers or doctors or solicitors or farmers or clothes-shop asistants or charity workers or drunks.

    What a fucking ridiculous comment. That’s as stupid as Tiernan himself.

    Comment by Des Priest
    89.
    September 27, 2009
    4:58 pm

    I thought the David Adams piece was a bit crass. Some of it was barmy.

    Comment by Dave
    90.
    September 28, 2009
    10:50 am

    Barmy indeed. A lot of it didn’t make any sense.

    Comment by other Dave
    91.
    September 28, 2009
    11:52 am

    @88 Agreed. What a silly thing to say.

    Comment by Peter81
    92.
    September 28, 2009
    3:55 pm

    @86 I kinda like Tommy Tiernan, so may be I am as ’stupid’ as him. But I do get a bit bored when I hear the same joke more than once. As a music lover, I love listening to the same song/album again and again and again. Music can appreciate with time (sometimes) whereas jokes get stale very quickly. I feel there is a lot of pressure on all comedians to reinvent themselves with every performance.

    That was the point I was trying to make. Its only an opinion.

    So forgive my choice of words. It seems like its not just Tommy Tiernan who embarrasses himself and puts his foot in it.

    Comment by Finola
    93.
    September 29, 2009
    11:15 am

    I have tried to analyse all this further.

    Some commentators are now claiming that Tiernan was merely taking the mickey out of a rabid anti-semite, that it was the anti-semite who was his target and not Jews. If you read his website “apology” you will not see any mention of this from him. If he had explicitly said this either in his preamble before the rant, or on his website then these commentators would of course have a point.

    Nevertheless, for the sake of argument let us accept that this was his true intention. Even on this presumtion the point is that he has layed into the Jewish couple who approached him over whether he was anti-semitic re his calling “the Jews ” as a people Christ killers. This latter accusation is one that has been levelled by anti-semites at “the Jews” thoughout their history, forgetting that Jesus was himself a Jew, as well as his followers. His riposte that it wsn’t “the fuckin Mexicans” is funny, but it also wasn’t “the Jews”. His perpetuation of the Christ-killing Jews is what constitutes the main anti-semitic element PRIOR TO his joking about the Holocaust.

    If it is “context” that is his defence then, if the rant on the Holocaust is seen in context with his preceding anti-semitic comments about the Jew Christ killers, then this may indicate a consistency in the flow of the anti-semitic theme, and one would have to wonder whether this was indeed intended to be an attack on Jews. Recall also that he has previously attacked Israel, and never Palestinians, or Moslems.

    Thus under the cover of comedy Tiernan has laid into Jews for Christ killing, made jokes at the expense of Israelis, and then tops it off by joking that 10 12 million Jews should have been gassed. There appears to be an anti-jewsih trend throughout these jokes, whether intentional or not.

    In stark contrast there is the fact that Tiernan has not made jokes about Moslems or the Palestinians. And for this omission you have to wonder: why not?

    Comment by mike

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