In conversation with FRANCES O'ROURKE
KATHERINE ZAPPONEis a senator, member of the Irish Human Rights Commission and lecturer in ethics at Trinity College, Dublin. From Seattle, she has lived in Ireland since the 1980s with Ann Louise Gilligan, her partner of more than 30 years, with whom she set up The Shanty community development project in west Dublin. Married in Canada in 2003, they continue to fight to have that marriage recognised here
‘I’M FROM SEATTLE and was living in New York, teaching at second level in New York city when I went to Boston College, which was offering a new PhD in religion and education.
“Ann Louise and I were the only two doing the doctorate. I was in my late 20s, Ann Louise in her mid-30s when we met in September 1981. I’d accepted that being lesbian was part of my identity from the age of four or five. By November, we were effectively engaged. In October 1982, an Episcopalian priest – a woman – conducted a liturgy in which we married each other.
“My parents didn’t know. It was a problem for me because I was worried that they would be disappointed. Falling in love caught us by surprise, but Ann Louise, who’s a fearless, free spirit, freely embraced me.
“One of the things I loved about Ann Louise is that she was very sporty, a champion at squash. I was very athletic too and we did a lot of running, learned to windsurf together. She’s also a great singer and dancer.
“It couldn’t have been a more exciting, magical time. I could never have imagined living anywhere but the US but there was no way Ann Louise was going to stay in America. My mother was from an Irish background and when I came here, I heard phrases my grandmother had used. My mom’s people – McGivneys and Dalys – were from Oldcastle, Co Meath and Virginia, Co Cavan: I discovered that Ann Louise had memories of her father’s relatives in Oldcastle – and they were McGivneys too.
“I taught liberation theology in TCD. We talked about starting a project for women who hadn’t had educational opportunities. We bought our home, The Shanty, 10 minutes from west Tallaght, converted a garage on the property and went to the local parish, said we wanted to start adult education courses. We’ve just celebrated the 25th anniversary of what’s now called An Cosán.
“We got married in 2003 in Vancouver, Canada. My goddaughter helped with my makeup, we had lovely frocks, the family fussed over us. My parents are in their 80s. They adore Ann Louise and she adores them. When my sister and brother introduce Ann Louise as their sister-in-law I’m still deeply moved.
“Going public with our case to get our marriage recognised was a huge decision but we felt it was right: there was a deafening silence about the legal recognition of same sex couples . . . but boy, is it tough to take on the Irish State. We respect the happiness of other people’s civil partnerships but civil partnership is not marriage equality. We want our marriage recognised.”
ANN LOUISE GILLIGANis from Donnybrook. In 1981, she enrolled in a PhD in Boston College, where she met Katherine Zappone. She resumed teaching when they moved back to Ireland and founded an MA in educational disadvantage in St Patrick's College
‘I WAS TEACHING IN St Patrick’s College in Drumcondra in a pensionable job, had a house and a car. My mother Imelda, to whom I’d been very close, had just died. Boston College accepted me to do the PhD. I rented my house, sold the car and got a year’s sabbatical.
“I had entered the Loreto convent in Rathfarnham at 17 but never became a fully fledged nun. I had a deep belief that I would meet someone, fall in love with them and spend the rest of my life with them.
“I have no memory in 1981 of anything the Catholic church did that impinged on me and Katherine. But as I’ve grown older I feel outrage that any institution can tell me that my intimate love of Katherine is evil.
“I have a goddaughter who wanted to do a study of gay marriage in Transition Year. Her teacher said ‘Don’t you know that’s against the ethos of this school?’ So she went off and did a study of prejudice and intolerance.
“In Boston, we were forever entertaining. Katherine adores a party, sings and plays her guitar. What was it about her that made me fall in love? I could say it was her physical beauty, her vitality, but I believe if you fall in love with someone, something about your essence connects to their’s: I think to have one’s lover as one’s best friend in marriage is an extraordinary privilege. I remember the excitement I used to feel when I was waiting for her, and then I’d see her – and I still feel that excitement today.
“We’d been given a very strong social justice education at school in Loreto in Foxrock and I remember when I entered religious life in Rathfarnham I thought ‘What return could I make to the Lord for all that I have been given?’
“In the Shanty, we had many volunteers. What was wonderful was that it was, and is, an intergenerational, inter-class model of education and enterprise.
“I started the centre for research into educational disadvantage in St Pat’s . . . middle class primary school teachers must have that awareness of difference around class and opportunity.
“We are quite different people – Katherine has a sports bike, cycles every weekend, I have a large BMW motorbike. You get a sense of freedom on a bike that you get nowhere else. Katherine loves detective stories, I’ll read my way through the Booker and IMPAC lists. But we both love movies.
“A civil partnership is not a marriage. In my opinion this means that we are denied full citizenship. To stand out on your own and fight the State is not an easy thing to do. There are difficult days and good days . . . but we are there for each other.”
