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  • irishtimes.com - Posted: November 25, 2008 @ 2:10 pm

    You’ll never look at an Irish venue in the same way again

    Jim Carroll

    It will probably take you about two minutes at most after you walk into The 02 to cast the Point to the very back of your mind. After five minutes, you’ll wonder just why the hell Irish audiences put up with – or had to put up with – that dreadful calamity of a venue for so long. And after ten minutes, you’ll dread seeing the words “playing at the RDS” associated with any act coming to Ireland.

    theo2-cgi1.jpg

    Yeah, it really is that good. I had a look around the venue last week as the opening date inches ever closer and was hugely impressed by the remarkable transformation which has occured inside the shell of the old Point. The sightlines are Vicar Street-like (and thankfully not Olympia-like). The way the seats are arranged means you’re closer to the action from what is supposed to be the worst seat in the house than you’ll ever be in other venues. And the attention to detail thoughout is not what we’ve ever seen in other Irish venues, with the possible exception of the Odyssey in Belfast.

    It may sit on the same location as the Point, but that’s as far as the relationship between the two goes. One is a potentially world-class venue – the other was a big old shed for trams and trains which found itself pressed into use as a venue because we’d nowhere else to use.

    Of course, there are a few caveats to be aired before the doors open and the punters come in for the first show. The venue have yet to have a band and 14,000 punters in so we have to take their word that the sound will be bang on. An extensive set of acoustic tests have already been done so I’m sure that any sonic imperfections which occur will have more to do with the quality of the touring band’s crew than the venue (something which was always the other way around in the Point). There will, naturally, be some crowd control teething problems as people get used to the venue and where everything is now located.

    But I can’t imagine it will take long for this place to bed down. Punters are already snapping up tickets for every blooming show scheduled for the 02, a remarkable fact given these hard economic times and the way Recession 2.0 is causing havoc with smaller, mid-size gigs. Given that the 02 is set to host many shows once destined for outdoor fields – where they usually underperformed – we can all get used to spending more time down on North Wall Quay.

    • 28 Comments

    1.
    November 25, 2008
    2:28 pm

    I said it was good didn’t I? I think the most impressive thing about it is they way they’ve nearly built a new building inside the existing facade.

    Comment by Ian
    2.
    November 25, 2008
    2:31 pm

    The venue sounds fantastic. Now if the rest of the Quays would just catch up and the luas would hurry up…sorry, am I being negative again? :)

    Comment by Honoria
    3.
    November 25, 2008
    2:35 pm

    Ian – yep, you did. Actually, I have yet to read a bad preview of the venue and there have been tons of previews

    Honoria – Luas arrives Aug 09 at the Point Village/02. As for the rest of the quays, well, there’s this thing called the credit crunch. It seems 02’s €25m arrived in the nick of time

    Comment by Jim Carroll
    4.
    November 25, 2008
    2:38 pm

    Anyone else think he’s being a little too harsh on the old Point?

    It may have just been a shed, as he said, but thats part of the old Dublin charm of the place. Also the fact that before it was a rock & roll venue it had U2 working on Rattle & Hum up in the rafters. It adds a bit of character and lineage to the place, and more importantly I’ve been to some great gigs there too.

    Now it looks like a big shopping centre with one old wall remaining for posterity.

    I think its good that we have a world class venue, but its also a venue that could just as easily be anywhere else in the world.

    Comment by Peter81
    5.
    November 25, 2008
    2:41 pm

    Actually, I have yet to read a bad preview of the venue and there have been tons of previews

    Massive building project n Ireland in not shit shocker.

    Some one call Joe. Or is he still getting miles over wifeybusinessclassgate?

    Comment by Ian
    6.
    November 25, 2008
    2:42 pm

    I’m looking forward to having a good look around. I like what they’ve done so far, both in terms of acts booked and building work. Shame about the name though.

    Comment by Darragh
    7.
    November 25, 2008
    2:53 pm

    Peter81 – I’m actually not being hard enough on it, It was a terrible building for live music because it was not built or adopted with live music in mind. I’ve no problem with “character” or “charm” in a venue, provided said character and charm contribute to the building being a great venue for live music. The Point was never that

    Darragh – Shame about the name though

    The alternative was the Harvey Norman 20 Percent Off Sofabeds EnormoMusicBowl so we were lucky

    Comment by Jim Carroll
    8.
    November 25, 2008
    3:00 pm

    I’ve been astounded by the sales for the 1st six months of the 02, there is defo an “o2 factor” involved.

    Chris Brown 2 nights at 12k a night nearly sold out? Tina Turner 8k each night for 4 nights? Girls Aloud 2 Nights? Snow Patrol 3 nights? Ill Divo 2 Nights?

    That’s very impressive business.

    Comment by Sean D
    9.
    November 25, 2008
    3:18 pm

    the existing facade, ian?

    are you mad?

    keeping the facade was no more than lip service – this is a completely new building (on the outside as well)

    Comment by Ally
    10.
    November 25, 2008
    3:22 pm

    Ally – I think you’re wrong about that, there’s actually more of the original building on view than there was while it was The Point. It’s an incredible job. Ian is spot on.

    Comment by Johnnie
    11.
    November 25, 2008
    3:27 pm

    Yep, what Johnnie said. They’ve built the new venue largely inside the old walls – once you actually go inside the building, this building-inside-a-building is immediately apparent. The main change to the old building was they took out most of the western wall.

    Comment by Jim Carroll
    12.
    November 25, 2008
    3:36 pm

    @7: ” …I’m actually not being hard enough on it, It was a terrible building for live music because it was not built or adopted with live music in mind. ”

    All a matter of opinion, but I’ll take it you know better about the science of sound than me. All I have to say is I’ve been to many a gig there, as we all have and I don’t think I’ve ever stood in the middle of the Point and been unimpressed with the sound (for a room that size) or at least felt it ruined the show.

    One of the last shows I saw there was the Leonard Cohen tribute concert — I was bored rigid, but the sound was absolutely crystal clear.

    Like I said, you’re being too harsh.

    Comment by Peter81
    13.
    November 25, 2008
    4:03 pm

    I’m looking forward to seeing inside The O2 (Girls Aloud – yippee!) but I must say that I really liked The Point. As ramshakle a place as it was, when you had a really explosive gig there The Point couldn’t be beat it for the pure, rough, cavernous atmosphere it had. I will miss that.

    I will not miss the toilets though. Shocking.

    Comment by Conor Furlong
    14.
    November 25, 2008
    5:05 pm

    I’ll miss the toilets in the old Point. Slopping through 3 inches of cold urine in the stinking hellhole jacks of Heuston Station proportions (Heuston: probably the worst toilets in Dublin) so I could trek back out, have my beer taken off me on the way in and lose my way in the whole disorganised mess. Ahhhh memories.

    Comment by adam
    15.
    November 25, 2008
    5:45 pm

    I heard Parts & Labor are playing there in Feb.

    Ooops, sorry I meant Crawdaddy.

    Comment by overfriendly concierge
    16.
    November 25, 2008
    5:54 pm

    What did bands who played The Point ever think? Was there any charm to the place from their point of you seeing as it wasn’t like a typical arena they would have played everywhere else?

    Comment by K
    17.
    November 25, 2008
    6:08 pm

    Re: crowd control problems

    Wouldn’t they have had to have a couple of “ramp up” events to qualify for their safety certs? Events involving a certain amount of people in the venue to test out things like crowd control. I know football stadiums have to do that, I would have thought a venue the size of the O2 would as well

    Comment by Paul
    18.
    November 25, 2008
    6:45 pm

    i have to agree with jc. it is a great venue. had a look around yesterday. it has that croke park ‘wow’ factor and then pretty quickly you do wonder how come it took this long. it will be interesting to see what the gig atmosphere is like there. at the size it’s at will decent bands get to play there?

    maybe if they drop their ticket prices way down we could have the phenomenon of local and new bands stuffing the place at €25 a head?

    a big plus factor is that you can bring drink to your seat now – they even have cinema style cup holders!

    the reason why you could not bring drink in before was to do with vat rulings. it was officially a theatre with no vat (13.5% for concerts) which apparently now they have changed.

    Comment by donal s
    19.
    November 25, 2008
    6:59 pm

    was wondering are readers of on the record actually going to any of the 02 concerts so far announced, i go to alot of gigs every year and so far the acts announced seem pedastrianand boring. Obviously they aren’t going to book anything unusual for the first year but honestly the line up so far is poor and unimagintive. A lot of indie wasteland like kaiser chiefs and snow patrol.I reckon i’ll only go to the depeche mode concert in the first year of the 02 opening.

    Comment by thomas lennon
    20.
    November 25, 2008
    7:33 pm

    Is it like the Odyssey? The sound in the Odyssey seems very good (based on my two gigs there) and it appears to be a fine venue, but it does all feel a bit dull and overly commercial, like an American football stadium or something. Still, as Jim said, being a good venue must come first, and character can come second.

    Comment by Lenny
    21.
    November 25, 2008
    11:43 pm

    Jim,

    Can’t agree with you on the Odyssey, it’s a ruddy Ice Hockey venue first and foremost, also it’s housed in the most hideous, soul-less shopping mall in Ireland. And as for the sound, well the one and only gig I was at there was Bob Dylan and the sound was absolutely dire, though I may be prepared to concede that this had something to do with Bob himself, as he basically mumbled his whole way through the gig as is his wont these days.

    Anyway, sorry for being so negative, I hope the O2 is as ace as you say.

    Comment by Neill
    22.
    November 26, 2008
    1:13 am

    it has that croke park ‘wow’ factor

    You mean you were wondering when they’d finish that final end of it?

    Comment by Ian
    23.
    November 26, 2008
    9:48 am

    Regarding sound in the Point, yes, there were times when it was bang on – a Springsteen solo show in 2005 comes to mind – but that was when the sound crew worked their socks off to make sure the PA compensated for the general live music unfriendly nature of the venue. Most times, the sound was appalling – a mixture of venue acoustics and bad soundmen, At least with the new venue, there will be no way for touring bands or promoters to blame poor sound on the venue.

    K – I think it was the audience rather than the venue that visiting acts probably found more charming. To them, it was/is another arena on the circuit

    Paul – I assume they have to have a few events like this. But all the tests in the world wont compare with the arrival 14,000 fans who have paid good money to see an act and who wont want to hear excuses about teething problems and the like.

    Donal s – Was that VAT thing ever properly publicised? I always found that rule was something punters were really fuming about – a bit of explaining goes a long way.

    thomas – I have to agree with you there. With the exception of AC/DC, very little of what has been announced to date would entice me to go along. But that’s the thing – you need acts with established audiences to fill the 02 and a lot of those acts are not ones OTR readers might necessarily shell out 60 euro to see

    lenny – no, nothing like the odyssey. For a start, the odyssey is really a sports arena and the 02 is definitely more of a super-sized theatre and would not be suitable for ice-hockey or basketball (well, not for the moment anyway). Also the stage goes the length of the building (like Vicar Street) rather than being at one end.

    neil – I’ve seen a handful of shows in the Odyssey and it was a far, far, far better experience than seeing shows at the Point or RDS. Easy to get in and out, good sightlines, good sound. You have to remember when you get to venues of that scale that you have to lose certain attributes because of the size of the crowd and building.

    ian – it’s unfinished at that end in tribute to the Dubs and their rare old times. Reminds them that they havent won an All-Ireland since work on the stadium began

    Comment by Jim Carroll
    24.
    November 26, 2008
    10:57 am

    johnnie at 10 and jim at 11…

    i haven’t seen inside so i’ll take your word that they have done a sympathetic job in designing the new structure around the old…

    …from the outside, the architects have paid lip service to the original building… keeping the facade was almost uneccessary…

    …now, i’m not saying that that is a bad thing… but call a spade a spade…

    …in addition to those comments, i travelled past it last night and the building did look a lot better both finished and in the dark… plus the scale of it should sit better once development along spencer dock and on the south quays has been finished…

    Comment by Ally
    25.
    November 26, 2008
    11:00 am

    keeping the facade was almost uneccessary…

    Ally – They had no choice – the Point is a listed building and they couldnt just send in the bulldozers. They had to get permission to knock out part of one wall and had to re-use that stone throughout the new build.

    Comment by Jim Carroll
    26.
    November 26, 2008
    11:31 am

    jim, i know that, i aint daft….

    that is exactly my point – if it is listed, it is listed for a reason… that reason is so that the integrity of the building from an architectural and historical standpoint is maintained… when you build a modern cube of ten times the volume jutting out from that original building, do you think that they’ve held on to that integrity…

    …i’d question it… hence they are paying lip service…

    that said, it’s ended up much better than i feared at one point…

    Comment by Ally
    27.
    November 27, 2008
    12:05 am

    Jim, whatever happened to that Leonard Cohen gig that was supposed to be on in the O2 at the start of December? I seem to remember the date being December 1. Was it cancelled because the place wasnt going to be ready on time?

    Comment by P&M
    28.
    November 27, 2008
    9:16 am

    P&M – Gig was scheduled (and listed on Lenny’s website) for Dec 1 but it quickly became obvious that the venue would not be ready in time so that was the end of that. Conspiracy theoriests may point to the fact that the venue is a Live Nation joint and Lenny is a AEG client and there is no way LN would open their new venue with an act from their biggest global rivals.

    Comment by Jim Carroll

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